1 August 2023

From implementing green initiatives to having a say in history lessons students at Craigmore High School in Adelaide's northern suburbs are empowered and supported to play a role in their learning experience.  In this episode Student Agency Leader Georgina talks to us about fostering student agency in the classroom and students Ellie and Elliot tell us why it's made them excited to come to school. 

Show Notes

• Areas of impact: Learner agency
• If you want to find out more about student agency and Craigmore's approach you can contact Student Agency Leader Georgina via georgina.davis734@schools.sa.edu.au 

Transcript

Intro: Teach is produced on the traditional land of the Kaurna people. The South Australian Department for Education would like to acknowledge the traditional custodians of the land and pay our respects to all Elders, past, present and emerging.

Dale Atkinson: Hello and welcome to Teach, a podcast about teaching and learning in South Australia. My name is Dale Atkinson from the Department for Education and today I am out at Craigmore High School and we're joined by Georgina Davis who is the Student Agency and Pastoral Care Leader at Craigmore High School. Hello Georgina.

Georgina Davis: Hello.

And we've also got Elliot who is a student leadership group member. He's in year eight.

Elliot: Hello.

Dale Atkinson: And finally Ellie who's a fashion design student in year nine.

Ellie: Hi.

Dale Atkinson: Thanks very much for joining us. So the reason we're out here is we're going to talk about student agency. What it is, how to get it, how to activate it and what to do with it when you've got it.

First of all let's have a quick chat with Georgina Davis. Georgina, can you tell us a little bit about Craigmore High School?

Georgina Davis: Yeah, absolutely. So Craigmore High School is a category 2 public school in the northern suburbs. We have years 7 to 12 here and we have an extremely diverse range of students from ATSI, EALD backgrounds and many different other backgrounds to be really honest.

So yeah, really diverse school with lots of fantastic students, over a thousand students on this site.

Dale Atkinson: Can you tell us a little bit about your journey as a school in terms of seeking to activate student voice and agency. What, what were the motivating factors behind it?

Georgina Davis: Yeah, absolutely. Um, so student agency has been a major part of Craigmore High School for a long time now.

I think even before I started teaching, to be really honest, and currently it sits with me as the Student Agency and Pastoral Care Leader, which is a new role this year at our site. Previously, it has sat with curriculum areas in regards to co-agency and students designing their curriculum. It's also sat in areas of leadership groups, which or other ad hoc programs where staff have volunteered to do those things.

And I think at the moment we're really working on refining that program and refining those curriculum areas and making sure they're really visible to all our staff and that they're able to understand the importance of student agency in our site for all staff.

Dale Atkinson: Now when I talk to my friends who are not educators about student agency, inevitably they always say, why would you bother asking kids about what they want to learn? So, what's the answer to that question? Why do we engage with students in this?

Georgina Davis: So student agency is a multifaceted approach to teaching and I think there's many, many, many wonderful approaches or reasons why you should use student agency. The reason that we use student agency, or I personally think student agency is really, really important, is it gives students an entry point and an engagement.

It's the same way that if you're at home and you are, okay, I've got a list of things to do right now, and one of them is clean the toilet, mop the floors, walk the dog, or baking. And baking is my passion. I love baking. I know which one as an adult I'm going to go to first. Which one is my interest? Which one am I going to be willing to engage in?

Which one am I willing to actually get some learning out of as well? Yes, I could probably learn how to effectively clean a toilet, but I don't really want to do it, so I'm probably going to rush it. I'm probably not going to do it really well. I'm not going to really pay attention. But if I, okay, I really want to bake a red velvet cake, I really want to refine the skills that I need.

Whether it be whisking eggs or making the best possible icing for that cake. I'm willing to have an entry point in that. I'm willing to engage in that. Students are willing to engage in things that they are interested in. They're not willing to, and I don't blame them, not willing to engage in things that they have no interest or stake in. Why bother?

Dale Atkinson: Yeah, I'm totally up for the baking over the toilet task to be honest with you. So let's talk about how you actively activate that. What does that process look like?

Georgina Davis: So at Craigmore High School, student agency is a multifaceted approach. It very much is multifaceted at this site. So the first thing is your stereotypical student agency group.

So your leadership group, which I feel like most schools would have these days, is our first sort of port of call. However, we've really made an effort to diversify those student agency groups. So making sure that I'm not just got your stereotypical student leaders, the kids that want to be there and are happy to have leadership attached to their name.

We've also got different groups. So for example, we have the Charter Ambassador Program, which we're about to start running, which gives students an opportunity to look at the charter and what impacts them and what makes them happy, safe and well, and that they get to involve themselves in that. We also run the Australian Refugee Association group and I have a group of girls that work to really make their voices heard in regards to the refugee space.

So it's a really diverse range of students in those leadership groups. We're also looking at forming an ATSI group to support Aboriginal learners at our site. So that's the first sort of facet of it. The other area moves towards the curriculum side. Now within curriculum there's two approaches again.

The first one is subjects that have been specifically designed with student agency at the focus and they would be at our year seven and eight level passion projects. So passion project was designed for students to explore their passion and that was designed with student agency at the focus. So that's our middle school version of agency in a curriculum subject and if you move towards SACE, we obviously have the new EIF and AIF pilots currently running through, where student agency is once again at the forefront.

And I suppose the third part of student agency at our site is looking at our curriculum areas. So your maths, your HASS, your English, your science. And in those areas, co-design is used to support student learning. So they should have a say in what they are learning in those subjects.

Dale Atkinson: What difference does that make in that last bit around the co-design? What difference does that make in terms of engagement for the kids?

Georgina Davis: Yeah, so I think it goes back to even what I was just saying before about the baking example. If you're willing to engage in that, the results are going to be more authentic. The outcomes are going to be better because students are willing to put the effort, willing to put the time in.

So if you've just got say two designated lessons a week, which we do at CHS, and say you want to do this really, really big project, you're obviously going to have to engage outside of school. I'm only going to engage in that if I have agency in it, if I have some sort of stake in it, if I have something that I'm willing to do.

So students are more dedicated in their learning. The outcomes are much better in that they are authentically learning things that are important to them that they know are going to guide or improve their future.

Dale Atkinson: And what are the, um, kind of metrics, what, you know, in education we are absolutely obsessed with data. What are the metrics in terms of what you're measuring and what you're seeing from, from this engagement?

Georgina Davis: Yeah, so we definitely have to speak to our curriculum leads on this one because within CHS obviously many different, um, curriculum areas. I know specifically, um, if we're looking at our leadership group, so not the curriculum area that we were just talking about, we're seeing an uptake in students actually participating in those leadership groups. The number has grown greatly and it's also diversifying, which is really important. So whereas before we had no students from our disability unit in our leadership group, this year we do. And we're also seeing a range of students from a range of different backgrounds involved in these leadership groups, which previously we may have seen less of.

So it's really good to see a diverse range of students within these groups.

Dale Atkinson: Yeah, that sounds incredible and very rewarding, I would imagine.

Georgina Davis: Yes, it is.

Dale Atkinson: Which is a good time, I think, to bring in the students, given that this is all about the kids. So Elliot, Georgina spoke a little bit about the student leadership group and you're obviously heavily involved in that.

Can you tell us a little bit about what that experience looks like and the impact that you're having at the school?

Elliot: The student leadership group is pretty much when a whole bunch of students come together and want to make change for their peers and the school, the school environment in general. We come together in this room and have like a list of things that we talk about, sometimes made by teachers, but we host it ourself and the teacher mostly takes notes.

Dale Atkinson: What have you been tackling this year so far?

Elliot: The stuff we've tackled so far is the green team, which is pretty much a way to help the environment around the school. There's been a lot of trash and litter, and lots of children just don't care about the environment. So we put together a group of different students to help clean up the school and educate around the subject.

Dale Atkinson: And what was it that made that one of the things that you wanted to focus on?

Elliot: Ever since I was a kid, I've always like seen bad stuff happening on the news and bad stuff happening to the people around me. And I've always wanted to make some change one way or another, even if it's just in a small school environment.

Dale Atkinson: And does it make you feel like you've got a bit more kind of control over your day here at Craigmore High School?

Elliot: I'm a very controlling person and I like having power over other things and being able to do what I'd like is really rewarding to me.

Dale Atkinson: And do you feel like you've made more connections with the other students here?

Have you sort of expanded out your friendship groups into areas that you wouldn't have expected?

Elliot: Definitely. Lots of the students in the student leadership group I had barely talked to before I joined and now I'm pretty close with them and I can just send them messages about what's happening or just talk to them in the yard.

Dale Atkinson: That's really exciting. Ellie, you were a fashion design student, uh, in year nine. Now, um, we were talking before we came on air about just how old I am. Now there is no, there is no way when I was at high school that there would have been a fashion design program in year nine. Can you tell me what that looks like, how that's happened, and what your experience has been.

Ellie: Yeah, so, originally, I'm going to put this out, originally when I started I was doing visual arts. No interest in jewellery at all. And then I suddenly picked up, I want to do jewellery, I want to make, you know, all these pieces, and my teachers just went, alright. Just do jewellery making, like, I'll help you do this.

So, jewellery making is a lot of like, focus, a lot of, um, of course designing, and you know, making practical things. And really delving into what you want to create as a designer.

Dale Atkinson: And what's been the experience over the last couple of terms? Like, have you been able to kind of create some really incredible things?

Ellie: Oh, yeah, of course. I've been able to fully make three pairs of earrings so far, big thing for me because I've never touched jewellery before I started this. And yeah, really being able to like expand my creativity in that department.

Dale Atkinson: And are you looking to go on with it, a little bit?

Ellie: Of course. I've had a blast.

Dale Atkinson: That's excellent. Can I talk a little bit back with you Georgina about what that experience might look like from a teacher because obviously there is an element of... kind of courage and trust that kind of goes into that sort of approach where you do meet a student on their own level.

What is it in terms of the conversations that you're having with your colleagues to kind of make that really give that permission for them to try something new?

Georgina Davis: It's a really individualised thing. So I can say all I want to be honest, but I think a lot of our staff have a lot of really great tools in their toolkit to do that. Megan Hill is Ellie's teacher and Megan is fantastic at co-design and as you can hear already, she's done some wonderful co design with Ellie so far. I think it's really about starting the conversation with students. Because it can seem quite scary to release the reigns a little bit because as a teacher you're like, okay, I need to have my learning assessment plans, I need to have my unit plans, lesson plans and I also need to make sure that this all comes back to the Australian curriculum.

So your hands are fairly tied to start off with and then you have students and you're like I really want to engage them in this and I really want to do this and you're hesitant to start. Most people are 100% and I totally get that but I think if we look at the outcomes as I was talking about before, it's easier for you to teach a class where you're not having to run up against behaviour because you won't have behaviour in your classroom if students are actively engaged and if students are doing things that they have chosen, say like Ellie making earrings, the behaviour is going to be at an all time low.

So it's really about me helping staff create that conversation or start that conversation, really starting to sort of discuss their interests. Things they don't like as well, and like really anything. So having that conversation to start off with is the starting point.

Dale Atkinson: Back to you Ellie. You've obviously had this great opportunity and experience of, of doing jewellery design within the fashion space. Have you been able to think about, uh, other areas that you might want to expand into and, and use to engage your education?

Ellie: Personally, at the moment, my HASS class, we were focusing on, in the beginning, wasn't interested in that. It was like, basic, you know, World War stuff. And my teacher has said to us, she's gone up to us and said, Hey, what do you want to learn about next semester?

Is there anything you're interested in? And this has really got me like, oh, okay. Like, this is something I can have a voice in. I can pick what I want to learn. And it's really helped me personally stay like, on track. I want to come to school now because I have a voice.

Dale Atkinson: So Elliot, in terms of, uh, next steps and directions for the student leadership group, you spoke a little bit about some green initiatives. Are there some other things that you're looking to tackle in the back half of 2023?

Elliot: We're working on having different clubs and lunchtime activities, because the very first thing thing we discussed in the leadership group was there being nothing to do at recess and lunch and lots of groups just walking around having no idea what to do.

So we want to set up like student run clubs where students can pick whatever they're interested in, that being like chess or theatre or gaming. And like set up a little room at recess or lunch with obviously a teacher present so they can just do what they'd like and express themselves in a little room with people that want to be there.

Dale Atkinson: It's such a different approach to like teachers telling you maybe you guys might like to play some soccer at lunchtime or something like that. Do you feel like the ability to kind of come up with those ideas yourselves is important?

Elliot: Yeah, a lot of lunchtime activities has just been this is happening at this time, come here, or this is going on in this room. And I feel like having the opportunity to like have students pick what they want to do and like how they do it is really good.

Dale Atkinson: Yeah, it's exciting, isn't it Georgina, in terms of being able to unlock the passion in the kids, but also give the teachers maybe a little bit more freedom to kind of engage with students in areas that might be interest from outside.

Georgina Davis: Absolutely. It's definitely, and it was a question asked of me this morning actually around like how rewarding this is. And I said, my favourite part of my job is like building relationships with kids and having a chat. And now in my role, I just do that all the time.

Dale Atkinson: Yeah, it's pretty exciting. So I mean, I asked the students about their plans for the back half of this year and you've sort of ran through at the start of the pod just about some of those things that you're looking at in terms of climate ambassadors and the Australian Refugee Association group and other groups like that.

Where are you planning to take this?

Georgina Davis: So you've heard that we've got a couple of different leadership groups. I really want to expand that, driven by student interest. So SLG is something that, like, leadership group is something that us as teachers are like, we need a leadership group. I really would like to throw that back to the kids and see what that they feel there needs to be leadership in regards to.

I did mention earlier about the ATSI leadership group and that's about diversifying our leaders. And I think it's really important to hear Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander voices throughout our site as well as in many other facets of our learning. That's why that exists and why it should exist.

And I think setting up more leadership groups where students get that say is part of what I'm going to do. Chatting to our principal, Sarah, I think I'd also really like to make this learning and the student agency learning more visible across the site. I think for new staff coming in, and we have many wonderful ECTs at our site, it's really hard coming into a new site, whether you're a brand new teacher or you've been teaching for 20 plus years and trying to understand the lay of the land.

And I think student agency has always been at the forefront of our school, but I think providing staff with the strategies, facilities to understand what the key components of that are and how to do it within their classrooms because it looks very different at a HASS level to a student leadership level.

They're both student agency but they look very different. So I think making the learning more visible for others is something that I'm really keen to work towards and really delving into those specific curriculum areas, HASS, English, etc. to really understand the excellence that's happening in their areas and making that visible to everyone.

Dale Atkinson: And where do you go for your own learning in this area in terms of the networks that you tap into and perhaps the knowledge of colleagues?

Georgina Davis: Yeah, absolutely. So, firstly, knowledge of colleagues is, would be my first thing. We have after school on a Thursday when the kids leave early. Um, we obviously have from 2.30 to 4.30pm and throughout this time, we have used that time for lots of literacy intervention for our school because that's something really important to our site. But I think I'd really like to tap into the wonderful student agency that's happening throughout our site and allowing others to present on their ideas.

So I think to be really honest, I think your first, and you'd be silly not to, is looking at staff here that are already doing it because we've already heard of the wonderful examples in Megan's class already. Why would we not go speak to Megan?

Dale Atkinson: And are you comfortable if people come and speak with you?

Georgina Davis: Oh, absolutely. Go ahead.

Dale Atkinson: Excellent. Alright. Well, we might make some of those details available, uh, either through us or, um, up on the notes in terms of contacting Georgina, which would be great. I guess we've got a bit of time for one final message. So I guess my final question to all of you is, what difference has the activation of agency made in terms of, for you Ellie and Elliot?

Elliot: I'm a lot more confident about my schoolwork. Having like, most of the time it's just a task sheet with like a list of things we have to do. And the rest is completely up to us. So I love just decorating my little slideshows or PowerPoints or whatever I have to do. And having the choice to put in a lot of effort or put in a little. Or paint this one colour, paint it another. I just love that.

Georgina Davis: Sounds great. Ellie?

Ellie: Totally agree. This has just been something that's, you know. Like I've said before, it just allowed me to get more motivated, just in general, coming to school. I'm like, alright, you know, I can choose what I want to do, I'm gonna go for it. It's like, I'd be silly to throw away the opportunity. Yeah.

Elliot: I'm a lot more happy coming to school if that means I get to do whatever I want instead of following a script that a teacher gives me.

Dale Atkinson: I get the feeling, Georgina, that that, what they just said there, is essentially the motivator for you, is that right?

Georgina Davis: Yeah, 100%. That is the first and forefront motivator. The other thing also, if I was adding my two cents, is it's, like, it's easier as a teacher. I know it might not seem like that, like you have to go into a classroom, you have to then like work backwards and have a chat to the kids, but, If you're not up against students that don't want to do the work, and I don't blame them, some of the curriculum, it can be a little bit tricky to either understand or get through sometimes.

If we're facing up against that, sometimes it's really important we then then have these agency, these discussions to help our students, which in all fairness makes my job a lot easier because I don't have to behaviour manage. I don't have to do any of those silly things I don't want to do. I can just have a chat. This is what we're doing. What do you want to do? Okay, let's do that. That's your lesson. It's so much easier.

So whether you're either baking a cake or

Dale Atkinson: making some earrings or changing the world through green initiatives, the more control and agency you've got, the better. Thank you very much. This has been a great chat. Georgina, Ellie, Elliot. Thank you.

Georgina Davis: No worries.

Ellie: Thank you for having us.